Maybe it’s just me but I always assumed that if you signed an agreement which this person did, you ought to follow through on what you committed to. I’m amazed at how many people on this thread just disregard the fact that the man read, understood, agreed to, and signed the terms prior to taking the job. Wow! no wonder there’s no trust in out culture anymore.
So basically, if I hire you for your SEO services, your “no-results, no pay guarantee” is meaningless if you feel justified for any reason in breaking your end of the deal?
At what point then do you feel honor bound to follow through with what you agreed to?
So if every company has an eternal and global non-compete then would you just decide to starve and die?
Fortunately this is currently illegal. I don’t think that a agreement is valid when it’s unfair.
I believe that his agreement is fair, I would first talk to your employer tell him how you feel.
Hopefully he will work with you. Give him some creative ideas, so that both of you benefit, you could pay him a percent of your jobs for competing in his area for the year, something like that.
If he’s a jerk and doesn’t care about helping you, I would advertise outside of the city and then after a year I would move in.
Who ever said anything about “global” or “eternal”? His agreement is neither.
I signed a noncompete when I (briefly) worked for FISH 5 years ago. Their “territory” is nationwide, if you want to get technical.
Worked there one month, quit, and started my own thing up. I just made sure not to step on any toes or steal any customers.
Matter of fact, I almost even sold my old storefront route to them.
I would ABSOLUTELY start up my own thing if this company can’t pay you what you need. In short time you will be clearing per-day what you make in a week now.
Just be prepared to deal with the reprocussions if this guy is an @$$ about it.
How big is your city? Does he work all over the city? Try simply working in areas where he doesn’t. If you can handle this amicably then you can create a situation where in the future the two of you can help each other instead of becoming enemies. You’ll be better off having other wcing companies (including this guy) as resources instead of competition.
You said that because he read and agreed to the non-compete he should be loyal to the agreement.
I am giving you an situation and seeing if you would be loyal to this obviously unfair agreement?
And to understand how you would react, where do you draw the line?
Would you starve and die, or would you decide to disregaurd the agreement?
WindowEntrpreneur: I didn’t read that you intended to work in your bosses backyard, in the same city. Are you suggesting that you’ll set up shop in a neighboring town? Or are you planning to disregard the agreement and build locally?
Just curious.
As someone who recently signed a noncompete of sorts, I can sympathize a bit.
I went into the Army for 6 years at age 17. I learned: 1. Keep my commitments as a matter of honor, and 2. Never sign anything I’m not wiling to abide by.
This is a good idea, but taken to its extreme, it doesn’t work.
If the army gave you an order that would require you to do something that required you to break a different commitment, what would you do?
If you are asked to complete a window washing job, and you realize that it will require you
miss your son’s birthday party, which you also promised to be at what will you do?
I do agree with you that the agreement the OP made is a fair non-compete and he should work through it
I am simply trying to point out that “it depends” neither absolute is right, it’s some where in between.
I will not break my word just because I don’t feel like it, I also will not fullfill a commitment,
that causes me unreasonable problems. It’s a personal line everyone has to draw.
There is a lot of value in keeping your word, people will quickly learn your word is worthless if you allow it to get out of balance. If you leave my home before you finished cleaning the windows and go to your son’s birthday party. Personally I find this to be reasonable and would let you go home. Some people might point to the contract and say get back to work, then you would have defaulted on your commitment to your son.
These situations happen to everyone.
Can you truely say you have never made any kind of commitment that
you didn’t keep, even the simple things, like I will take out the trash today?
David, I don’t believe in moral relativism, I think things are pretty much right or wrong. The examples you give are not really relevant to the topic because in this thread we are discussing a specific agreement, not all agreements in general. Furthermore, yes I have broken agreements like forgetting to run some errand for one of the kids or not mowing the lawn when I told my wife I would. However, those were generally low level agreements that we all break as part of our normal social commitments, like agreeing to be at friends BBQ on Saturday but then having to fix a broken water pipe instead. Those kind of examples are a far cry from entering into a legally binding business contract. I appreciate what you are saying, but it’s not apples to apples in this case.
Seems like you do believe in moral relativism.
Panelessperfection: The city I live in is a bit isolated from neighboring cities so thats not an option. I am going to stay away from the downtown area where most of the company I currently work for business is.
I want to focus mainly on residential anyway. The areas I want to be working in still have some clients of my current employer but not many, and I have no intention of stealing them. I want to find my own.
Steve: I can appreciate your moral concern for this situation. However I feel that non compete agreements are drawn up in order to protect the interests of the company not hinder the ability of a former employee to provide for himself. The intention behind the contract is what I think really matters and I do feel that I would be in the wrong if I were to negatively affect my employer’s company. However I also feel that starting a business in a honest way is not immoral. The contract is there to cover them in the event I committed some shameless act that would hurt their company.
My main concern is the legality of this and the likelihood I would be taken to court.
Then obviously you don’t get it.
From my prospective as a window cleaning business owner I would say to approach your boss and express your intentions.
Tell them how you would love to stay but making peanuts is not enough to provide for your family. Express how you have no intentions of stepping on his toes or going after their clients. Who knows he might wish you well or kick you down a flight of stairs. As long as you are honest and explain why you want to go out on your own like you have here you should not have any problems.
Also, your bosses non compete will not stand if you are not able to provide for your family on your salary and/or are not working full time, that comes first.
JMO
I’m going to jump in and agree entirely with Steve The man. I worked for Fish as well for about a year and never really read the non compete I signed. After the situation kept getting worse and worse working for my employer, I left and went out on my own. However, as much as I still dislike the guy I worked for and feel cheated by the working situations he would force on us for less then minimum wage… I have found all my work outside of the area that I agreed to avoid, and have not solicited to any of his customers. As much as other people … our lives …or our situations effect us, and seem to give us a reason to justify certain actions… They don’t. Form your convictions (or your signed agreements) and then be a man and stand on them. Period. If you are not making enough money go find another job. If you can’t work outside of his “city limits” then quit for a year and if you still have window cleaning running through your veins, then start a company. If you are in college, you are young enough to wait. How much is your integrity worth?
Hmmm.
Okay, then here are my two cents:
Level with your employer, and explain what you’re doing, and that you would like to honor the non-compete by not pursuing his clients for a period of 3 years, so that he has nothing to worry about.
Then explain that you’re going to focus on building a residential client base, primarily, so chances are he won’t even see you around…
If he says absolutely not, because you signed a non-compete, and he is going to hold you to it, then you will have to deal with that moral/legal question. I have a feeling though that if he can be guaranteed that you won’t go anywhere near his clients for an even longer period (3 years), that he will be willing to grant you the concession of breaking off on your own locally…
Those are my thoughts.
Anything beyond 5 miles, and 2 years you won’t have to worry about was what I was told by my attorney. Again a noncompete is desinged to help against an unfair advantage or stealing a trade secret and using it against the former company. It will cost him/her too much to fight. BUT be upfront about it. To me breaking my noncompete was like breaking a bad cellphone contract. Contracts are made to be broken. Vows are not. That is what I came to in my ethics search. I worked over 10 years for someone else and felt I made him a lot of money in that time. To have waited 2 more years in this economy for me and my family wouldn’t have been an option for me. The bottom line is this is something you have to make up your mind about, and see if it is worth taking a risk. Just make sure before you do anything consult your local employment law attorney to inquire how strict Arizona law is on this subject.
I dont intend on soliciting to any of their customers, and i wish to stay as far away from their main bubble of buisness as resonably possible. It just seems like I could be making the same amout of money in less than half the time plus I want to gain the experence of running a buisness.
[QUOTE=WindowEntrepreneur;91190It just seems like I could be making the same amout of money in less than half the time plus I want to gain the experence of running a buisness.[/QUOTE]
Yup, you’re right. Level with the guy, and then move forward with both of you aware of what youre doing…
