Yes Gary: Very serious people like yourself would rather get to the point than waid through seemingly endless banter but a few of us actually enjoy it. 
I get that everyone is allowed to heckle - everyone is allowed to try to keep trying to suck the life out of a thread for their own enjoyment.
This time - just this once - please do your industry a favor and step out of the way.
Now that was funny! Gary do yourself a favor and lighten up. You’ll live longer.
You won.
Gary: Some people out there are saying Tempered glass should NEVER be scraped with a razor because SOMETIMES it will scratch. I think I might be one of those guys. Any thoughts Gary?
Sure - you don’t think I can resist commenting on your fake opinion.
You’re a couple hundred messages too late to pretend you might care what I think.
Gary: Now I guess I know why you don’t allow bantering on your forum.
My apologies
And yet the real show will go on.
Gary, your time and knowledge are a valuable contribution to some day getting glass manufacturers to get on the ball.
But the fact is, not everyone is as fiercely devoted to this small piece of the whole window cleaner pie as you are.
Fact - this was far and away the month’s most popular thread.
With a high percentage of it being heckling as you already said.
There have been only 3 or 4 hecklers. (You don’t count because you got here too late.)
I am very glad I did this - sorry to see it end this way, but this thread was a very productive exercise for me, and I appreciate Chris Lambrinides inviting me here.
Gary: Don’t let the heckler’s get you down. It’s the culture here. Everybody here knows you know windows! 
PS It’s a great thread.
No matter what the subject or background - attitude is everything - as Rob the Carpet Mouth found out. I don’t know if heckler defines it as much as people, when they feel pointed at, will point back or they will go with the flow. Stick to the message if the message is what you want to stick to.
These 3 or 4 hecklers obviously kept trying to disrupt the flow - mostly before I ever said anything to them.
Heckler is used correctly here - and I would never use that word to describe someone who merely disagrees or seems disagreeable to me.
People are heckling when they have nothing to say, don’t care, and won’t shut up.
Huge difference between this an the carpetguy thread - he invited himself - fully intending to use his attitude to tick you guys off and leave.
I was invited here by the CEO himself - stayed focused on helping OUR industry - and I’m still here.
(Near as I can tell I’m still welcome.)
Um, if this thread has NOT run its course, let’s forget about hecklers.
How about time-delayed tempered glass scratch growth - whether you believe it happens, and what it means to our industry?
This is a good thread Gary and I hope you stay around…
I understand the response. Just saying stay on subject and let everything else go. Good info to be had for those that want it.
“How about time-delayed tempered glass scratch growth - whether you believe it happens, and what it means to our industry?”
I don’t know if I can say that I believe or disbelieve that it happens for I do not have intimate knowledge of the idiosyncrasies of how todays glass is affected by outside influences (us window cleaners). I do believe that someone who has worked in the trenches so to speak and holds that knowledge can better answer that question. So the question of “whether any of us believe it happens” doesn’t seem to be productive. Scratches do happen, we can all believe that. What causes them and how to best avoid them to better our industry is knowledge that should be of interest to us all. Also how best to discuss this problem with clients and contractors would be great to discuss as well.
@ Gary Mauer
You’ve likely saved me money, time, and reputation. I’m no longer ignorant to time-delayed scratch visibility and many other heat-treated glass topics. I thank you for this thread. Since you have given me this info and have offered valuable suggestions, perhaps I will be the first to say that I plan to no longer act out of ignorance by baselessly criticizing other window cleaners by, for example, blaming them for simply using a scraper. This does not include blaming window cleaners who knowingly or somehow irresponsibly thrash windows. I know that this is hard to prove since there may have been time-delayed visibility issues, so I will keep that in mind.
A couple questions:
-You say you do not use scrapers on coated glass. How can you tell if it’s coated? Are you just talking about different types of films, such as tint and graffiti film?
-What would be your explanation to a judge for using a scraper, etc when it is against the manufacturers suggestion? Even if they are wrong, isn’t this a hard thing to reason out of through a judges perspective (I know that you are not a lawyer).
-Why do you discuss people “owning” a scraper, as apposed to “using” a scraper. I feel like I’m missing something.
-What are some red flags for you when it comes to choosing whether you will proceed with a CCU project?
-Why has it taken 15 years for a window cleaner to find out about time-delayed scratch expansion? Not that I don’t appreciate it.
- When it comes to cleaning CCU or routine annealed glass, do you see value in using steel wool, chemical, or abrasive pads INSTEAD of using a scraper?
When I asked “whether you believe it happens, and what it means to our industry” earlier, that was a rhetorical question - now I’m asking you 3 questions directly.
1 - When you’re trying to decide whether tempered glass just got scratched - does it matter whether on not the scratches will look worse later?
2 - When you’re trying to decide if you - or any other window cleaner - should have seen tempered glass scratches - does it matter if the scratches look worse now than they did at the time?
3 - Do you require clients to sign a heat-treated glass scratch liability waiver?
(Yes or no answers will suffice.)
