WCN & Cliff Monroe

True! Unfortunately that’s the Irony of poor quality heat treated glass.

Eventually…some poor uneducated WC’er is going to get jabbed for scratching up some defective glass,be it on a construction site or with signage removal or even on a straight clean etc.

That’s why we get a “Waiver” signed and hopefully have the opportunity to educate anyone & everyone involved!

Is there a fabricator who recognizes fab. debris as a problem? Seems like if there was a company who consistently churned out quality glass free of fabricating debris, they could use the situation to their advantage. Arch, Old Castle and others wouldn’t have a choice but to clean up their act.

They all are aware of it,especially since it’s become such a “hot topic” Guardian,PPG & AFG produce good glass for the most part & there are a few others as well.Although some of these “so-called” certified fabricators PPG has are something to be desired.

What’s funny is…not all fabricators are producing garage,only a few. Those that have there act wired tight (my hats off to them) the other offending fabricators need to take note!

The problem with this is the “snake den” dynamic. There was a chance to open some real dialog here, and while nothing would have been solved (No hallelujah moment for Arch), the longer Cliff hung around, the more at ease he felt, the more communicating he did, the better the chance that something, anything, could have been gleaned from the conversation.

He posted, he replied to a few select questions, he got blasted, attacked, questioned, and basically treated like a piece of meat in a lion’s den, and now he’s been very quiet, and may never post again. That’s not good for anyone.

I sent Cliff a private email thanking him for getting active again and apologizing up front for the barrage I knew he was exposing himself to. I doubt that did any good, because he’s been off for most of this week.

That really is too bad, because if we could have engaged him in rational, civil discussion, he maybe would have let something slip that we could have used at a later time.

Arch was fully aware of his participation, from what he told me.

GANA is not going to change their stance about heat treated glass surfaces being different, certainly not due to the bitching of a couple hundred window cleaners. But if we could have mined for that one nugget, we’d have that much more ammo for discussions with builders, which is where this position (crappy glass) ultimately needs to end up. GANA will listen to builders, but not window cleaners.

Thanks Jeff

You summed up what I was trying to get at. You delivered the thought much clearer than I.


That shame on cliff email seemed a little harsh

I as well as many would have liked to see something positive & constructive come out of this most recent visit of Cliff’s " good dialog" but …if Dan had thought so highly of it or thought it had potential i hardly doubt he would have laid into him.

As for other replies…as i’ve said before patience runs thin with this topic and has for sometime now.

You can “wish” till the cows come home,ain’t happening this time around;)

And yet a post of yours (“automotive”) intentionally proved otherwise.

It’s water under the bridge now:D

And yet it contradicts your current posting:

Not really! But you go ahead and pick it apart all you like,is not going to change anything.:wink:

Reminds me of the time that Pilkington Glass did a seminar at Windex UK saying that all this self cleaning glass would put Window Cleaners out of work for good in the next 20 years. (We all know it doesn’t work!). But the only guy to go forward after all the goading was Guizi Gulliermo? (from Pulex - now retired) asking how the problem glass could be cleaned with the restictions on cleaning the special coating. It shows that the business minded actually work with the problem more than criticising it. Respect to the dude - hopefully we will all think this way soon. Good on ya Jeff!

I believe getting out of the problem & into the solution is what anyone would want.Unfortunately…too many times in the past this (particular topic) has arose with little or no substance, remedy or…valuable “Nugget worthy” dialog.

People waited patiently with baited breath only to be put on the back burner one more time.

If you can’t answer or at least attempt to answer various questions thrown at you then…maybe you(being Cliff) shouldn’t have teased people?

On a lighter note…I’ve had the pleasure of meeting Mr.Gulliermo on several occasions at past IWCA conventions “Top Notch” guy all the way.:wink:

Patiently?!? Get real.

Yeah…some did get “Real”… quick!



Mine was sarcastic. :wink: