I’m not in love with mine, maybe if I had a more convenient set up, like everything stays on the truck and I don’t even have to hook up to customers water.
I don’t even bother with wfp on one story houses because I can do the entire house before I even set up my hoses.
I don’t think I’ve done an entire outside on two story houses. I always have to break out the ladder and go traditional on some windows.
I just might relegate wfp’s down to jobs where I might have a wall of windows or a lot of very high windows in a row.
I still question it’s quality and frankly so has every customer I’ve done.
I’m reminded of that thread that said we were lax in quality and too lazy to climb a ladder, LOL.
Same here, I don’t know but I think I may have had my hopes up too high before I bought my system. I have my setup inside my van always, but I only use it when there is maybe a few hard to reach windows with the ladder. Usually when I try using JUST the wfp I feel like I’m not doing a good job because of the fact that i can’t see it up close and use a razor of needed. (I’d rather not hookup a razor to my pole, I’m not sure that is quit safe or the best idea).
While there are some homes where wfp isn’t ideal (poorly maintained wooden frames or storm windows) with the proper learning curve behind you it is amazing how many homes are much easier to do w/ wfp. I think when some start they expect it to be a magic wand and forget that they had to learn to use a squeegee. WFP is the same. It takes a bit to learn proper technique. On smaller homes I use a back pack which eliminates the set up time from the equation.
As for the razor issue - it isn’t any different than using one on a traditional pole safteywise. There is a special trick I use when putting it on my Reach Around goose neck. Here’s a video describing how I do that -
I think it depends on the window you are attacking with it. I don’t use mine on every home. But then again, there are some guys who include hardwater removal in the cost of their service. I do not. If I use my system on a home that has HW of course the results are not going to be great. But that’s the same with a traditional clean or wfp. There are so many factors involved into what could be wrong. Not busting your stones here Mike. Just saying. If there are a bunch of other cleaners using it without issue and you’re having an issue. Then what’s most likely the issue? The equipment, the window or the operator? Whats the most likely cause of failure?
It can be the equipment or the operator or the window…or all 3 on any given job. I too, have issues with the quality of work of the wfp. First of all, how can you say a window is really clean when you can’t see it? I have used my pole and discovered areas that had to be redone when I started on the inside. My biggest issue is with the brushes, many are too soft for my tastes.
If a piece of glass has had some or any kind of maintenance over the years, the pole will do a decent job, but if the glass has been years exposed to the elements and coated in grime and bug guts, using a soft brush and pure water won’t cut it many times. If pure water cleans everything, try washing your clothes or towels in it alone.
I have guys who just “go through the motions” when cleaning with mop and squeegee, leaving spots and dirty corners. What do you think happens when they have the pole in their hands and wiping up and down on high windows they can’t see?
I will step out on a limb here and say I have had and used a WFP as long or longer than anyone on this board. I bought my first Tucker Pole way back in 1992, and I will say that for many jobs it has been a great help, but it has it’s place as a tool in my box. I don’t pull it out for every job because it is time consuming to set up and use, versus a bucket and squeegee…and it is expensive in really hard water areas. Those of you who live and work at sea level know what I am talking about
Chris’s company doesn’t seem to use it, it’s not mentioned in their website at least. (50 window cleaners). Beautiful view (mark the window cleaner) no mention as well, Paneless perfection as well…
I might not have much experience with wfp poles but I do know what clean glass looks like. I may have detail disorder because I’m used to near perfection with traditional cleaning, but I see spotting even after rinsing like crazy with the wfp. I think the planets have to be aligned and the sun shining to dry it quickly, to have a perfect window with pure water.
I can’t say for sure but… this is the home of the 7 step window cleaning method and the internet. So I’ll take everything said here with a grain of salt.
1 other thing, nobody in my city uses this method that I know of.
Yup, that’s the bad thing when it comes to WFP and employees. The guy I had this year was trained 1st day on the job with it. I stopped letting them use the system for two reasons 1) I needed to purchase filters and it took about a month on the order. 2) According to my female employee, he was using it on every home regardless. This was causing quality issues and a some call backs. When I told him he was not going to be using it and had to go old school with a ladder he seemed cool with it. But my female employee told me when on the job. He was not happy and was slacking in the quality. Well 3rd call back and he was let go.
Totally agree. It’s just a tool and you have to pick when and where to use it. I think too many window cleaners have the wrong idea about these things. I think they are either misunderstanding the role and capibilities of the tool or just don’t get it altogether. I think many believe this tool is going to make it so they never have to ladder again. Or they can just spray a window and POOF clean. It does not work that way. Many times on first cleans we will face to glass the home. It’s the 2nd clean 6 months later that brings the bigger profit. Even on the 2nd clean there are times we need to break out a ladder. But again I think other cleaners think it’s a magic tool.
That’s my experience and I know that lots of people don’t complain even if they’re not satisfied and I feel guilty and more then a little worried because I’m also not satisfied with the results. I was just so dead set on wfp’s that I was forcing it on every window I could… to justify the money I spent I suppose. I’m not saying I’m unhappy I bought them, I know they will come in handy… but like mr squeegee said, it’s certainly not a magic wand. (and I was hoping it was :p)
Edit: as far as soft brushes go, I don’t think hard brushes would make a difference, in fact it might be worse. I can’t get any pressure at all on the brush unless it’s right in front of me so there is no way I could lay down hard bristles 26’ up and scrub.
Ok well just cause it’s not mentioned on their site does not mean they dont use it. I’m pretty sure they do. But you might want to ask them directly to be sure.
As I said before. Could the issue be you and how you use the pole? Maybe you are not rinsing correctly? I have seen my employees wash a frame, wash a window, rinse the frame and window together. WRONG. If you rinse the frame an window together, the frame will drip the dirt down. The frames should be washed, rinsed and then the window washed and rinsed. And rinsed well. I’m sure you know what clean glass looks like, you’re a pro and should know that. All I’m saying is might not be doing ti correctly. Or maybe you are and there are other factors, like the glass you are using it on is not worth using it on. Lets look at it like this. When you use it, are there any sections of the window that look clean? If so then it’s not the system but the method in which it’s used. Just like a traditional tool that one would use, yet still sees spots or streaks. If I use and old school method and had spots and streaks afterwards should I turn around and say squeegee’s dont work and I’m sticking with amonia and news paper? No there are other factors. Could be my rubber is bad, could be my channel is bend, could be the angle I’m holding the tool etc.
Then maybe there is reason for it. Have you asked any of them why? What type of windows prodominatly are in your town? Wooden frame, aluminium, vinyl? I’ll put it like this. If I lived in a hardwater area, or area where the weather is not so great most of the year and my customers had the 2 first types of windows I mentioned here. I would not be using a WFP. The results are going to be subpar 90% of the time.
We have all three types of windows, in about the same proportion as far as I can tell. But even I’m not going to use a wfp on aluminum because they,re sliders and need to be taken apart, even storm doors. The rest, at least as far as my customers go are half wooden and half vinyl. I do have most of my problems on the wooden ones but like I said I was forcing it. Cold damp weather, that could have something to do with it I guess.
I have seen my employees wash a frame, wash a window, rinse the frame and window together. WRONG. If you rinse the frame an window together, the frame will drip the dirt down. The frames should be washed, rinsed and then the window washed and rinsed.
I have tried to be diligent doing that, to the point where I would do the entire house, frames and windows washed and rinsed, then go back to just rinse the glass again. It was impossible with the fan jets, I kept hitting the top frame, but I converted to pencil jets with vikan sill brush.
I just hate worrying about window cleaning, I’m always so confident with it.
Then maybe there is reason for it. Have you asked any of them why?
It’s because they haven’t heard of it. These guys are not going to give employees poles, we used to have to steal rubbers, lol. cheap.
Mike are you trying a pre-scrub? And listen here. I feel where you’re coming from. No one likes to buy something that is so much money only to have questionable results. I pre-scrub every job. But I also have a helper who does that. The employees are trained to pre-scrub every job first. If your doing it alone it can take sometime and would say because of the pre-scrub it’s not as fast as a traditional ladder all the time. You end up doing double duty on the job. When I was going it alone. I would pre-scrub all the windows first and that was pain. But worth it for me as it made the results better. But also with that said when you pre-scrub you have to rinse really well.
I agree I don’t think a harder brush is going to cut crud. But a backflip with a scrub pad will do nicely. I don’t have one because of the pre-scrub. I dont see a need for one at this time again because of the pre-scrub. But I will be trying one out this year because if it works, it’s going to save time. I feel for you man. But if I had to take a guess to the biggest cause of your issues. It’s the wooden windows and those big ass lakes you have up there. The worst windows I deal with here are ocean front. I tell the customers right up front. The windows are going be nasty. I dont even have to look at them. I know they are going to be bad. WFP cant take off most of the junk on them. But my customers who live there understand why I can’t. They also do not want to pay for any removal of anything from their glass cause they know in 6 months it will be back. At the ocean we have some old homes who are wooden frame. I won’t touch them with a WFP. Not worth the wasted time. I only use it on newer windows. But newer windows are what 70% of my customers have.
On a very large house I tried this method where I used just tap water and left in running the whole time. I scrubbed frames and windows and rinsed with tap water running. (64 windows). Then I put the DI tank inbetween the tap and the hose reel and rinsed them all down with pure. there were still some windows (wooden frames) that looked iffy to be even before they dried, though I think the house as a whole came out ok. I only did his office on the inside and that one window I had to go outside and do over because the top corners were horrible and I totally missed it when I was doing them outside. I hope I did a good job, it was the only job I actually made time on compared to ladder work.
edit: Some of those windows, had tin or aluminum I guess, frames and they were casements. Now I’m, clued in, I’m so used to just sliders being aluminum but we do have casement frames as well. Not too many though.
edit 2: I don’t know what I’m talking about wfp this early for, I have to put on some christmas lights and do a yard clean up today then change the oil in my snowblower:p.
[quote=“Mike the Window Cleaner,post:13,topic:10217”]
On a very large house I tried this method where I used just tap water and left in running the whole time. I scrubbed frames and windows and rinsed with tap water running. (64 windows). Then I put the DI tank inbetween the tap and the hose reel and rinsed them all down with pure. there were still some windows (wooden frames) that looked iffy to be even before they dried, though I think the house as a whole came out ok.[/QUOTE]
An effective pre-scrub method is a GG4 solution and an Ettore Porcupine strip washer (thanks Mr. Robinson.)
Yeah I’ve noticed that too. I’ve had to dial it back but then it rinses slower, I didn’t think it would be much of a problem. I do try to do the frame and window separate as jugernaut mentioned but it’s pretty hard to control that water on 2nd story windows, I can’t even imagine 4 storys.
