IWCA election - Voting Rights

Announcements
1

I have served on the board, repeatedly, and as an advisory member I am unable to vote during the board meetings. Advisory positions are appointed by the incoming president. I am not the only board member that thinks advisory members should have voting rights.

Without discussing the merits of individual candidates I do have a problem with the IWCA bylaws, in regards to advisory and professional board positions.

I would consider an advisory position to any one who owns a supply house , or sells supplies, or manufactures window cleaning products.

Professional members are window cleaners and have voting rights. Associate members do not have voting rights. My youngest son, Joshua 19, has a landscaping business which also provides window cleaning services. I’ve cleaned a few windows and with the current bylaws could serve on the board as either an advisory (associate member) or a professional window cleaner. We could split hairs, having certain children serve as as advisory members and other children run for professional positions. Using this line of reasoning, Joshua is not on the payroll at *** so he should have voting rights. Jacob works at *** so he should be in an advisory position. One gets to vote and one doesn’t.

Another issue is the cost of dues. Associate members pay more than Professional members. It is not fair that I pay more but don’t get to vote. I remember one year Mark Unger termed it: “taxation without representation”.

As the bylaws are currently written I think it appropriate, when you have a situation where an individual both engages in window cleaning and sells or manufactures window cleaning supplies, this company or person should be considered only for an advisory position and pay higher dues as an associate member.

I have served on the board, repeatedly, and as an advisory member I am unable to vote during the board meetings. Advisory positions are appointed by the incoming president.

The bylaws should allow associate members to have voting rights. If this change does not happen, then I don’t think anyone with a supply company should be candidate in the upcoming election.

I welcome Mr. Lambrinides, to work hard along side other associate members in an advisory capacity. But as the rules stand right now, it is a conflict of interest for him to run in this election. The easiest solution is to give every member of the IWCA voting rights.

2

One of the differences between you and Chris Lambrinides is the fact that before he had a supply house he had and still does have a successful window cleaning company. Instead of changing the rules why don’t you simply start a window cleaning company and then see if you can get the votes to get on the BOD?

3

From my experience in attending IWCA conventions for many years past, it isn’t young blood that the association needs. I think more of the older veteran window cleaners need to get reinvolved. Sitting in on the seminars at the convention the past few years was like having a kindergarten teacher trying to teach college algebra. The IWCA has guys who have a few years of window cleaning experience giving seminars. I think that there is so much to be learned from the older “legends”, and I think the association would have much more to offer, rather than paying to sit and listen to “young blood”. We brought 4 guys down to the IWCA convention this past year and our employees were more knowledgable on the industry than many of these young guys that presented seminars. From my perspective, We need to get some true knowledgable window cleaners active in the IWCA mix in order for the young learners to benefit from the association.

4

Below is my reply to Chris Wallace that I made on World today. Of course it got filtered, and never made it through…

I remember this question coming up in the past. Gary answered the question in this email:

On Dec 1, 2008, at 3:13 PM, “Gary Mauer” <moms@wcmail.net> wrote:

>>>If a professional member becomes a non-voting Associate member then how can they serve as a regular board of director member?**-- Chris Wallace<<<
*
By maintaining theProfessional membership theirwindow cleaning business - as long as that is still viable.
*
It’s my understanding that an IWCA*Professional member can - and always has been able to -*purchase an additional Associate membership if they get involved in a service or product that is sold to Professional members.
*
Also my understanding that many who are eligible to be Associate members choose not to do so - and forego the benefits enjoyed by Associate members (such as they are.) Someone who chose not to become an Associate member would be ineligible to be appointed to the the BOD as an Advisory member.
*
Thanks,

Gary Mauer
Since 1996* - the Window Cleaning Network
Oconomowoc, Wisconsin, USA
Window Cleaning Network - find window cleaning supplies and network with other professional window cleaners!

Later Paul West, then president of the IWCA, confirmed that Gary was correct. In fact, he even stated “A person can run two separate companies and wear a different hat depending on the occasion.”

Thanks,
Micah Kommers
We Wash Windows
Greenville, SC

5

Joseph,

        Curious to know what seminars you & your crew attended? I for one gave 2 seperate seminars and im anything but a new kid on the block!

I completely understand your reasoning as this is…the best way to ensure the message gets delivered to the appropriate committee. Im sorry you felt as though some of this past IWCA convention(Atlanta 09) seminars were rather light and with the presenters being less then seasoned in some cases.

6

Definately not any of the seminars you presented. I would consider guys like yourself as veterans and knowledgable window cleaners. Don’t get me wrong, there were some great seminars, I’m just saying that for the long run of the association, the veterans need to be the backbone. I’m not going to call anyone out in particular, and I appreciate anyone who donated their time and effort to presenting a seminar.

7

Since seasoned doesn’t necessarily mean being a window cleaner for dozens of years I think the term young blood is really signifies that the individuals will be in the industry for many years to come where as long time window cleaners will be moving on towards retirement. Every association out there wants to attract new, long term members. With the wealth of information out there now I don’t think a guy needs to be in the industry for 10, 20, or more years to be qualified to help others by being on a panel. The IWCA will benefit by participation by all members.

8

While there are those still willing to donate their time and money and share as speakers; It’s my impression that the IWCA does not treat many of the volunteer speakers, and other volunteers very well.

I’ve heard that volunteer speakers usually even have to pay to attend the entire convention! And pay for their own lodging, travel and expenses to boot!

I’ve heard, but hope it’s not true that there is a “rule” that the IWCA can not pay a member to be a speaker! --Say it isn’t so!

On top of that the IWCA has a surcharge in membership dues for any larger, more successful company owners! – Exactly the people members they should be trying to attract! How much more does it cost to have a successful company as member than a small one-man operation? Who needs the association more?

There is also the fact that while there is a lot to gain by sharing, there is also a lot to loose and risk, especially for a more successful operation; when one’s direct competitors are in the audience. Wh

9

Thank you for your reply. I will clarify my statement from earlier. If i am not mistaken Chris you run a supply store for our industry. To my knowledge you have never owned or operated first hand a window cleaning business. Have you been through the problems first hand that i face as a window cleaner and owner? If you have never “been there and done that” why would i want you to have a say in an industry that is supposed to represent me, the window cleaner. Its like Steve Blyth at **********. Great guy, do i want him voting on matters that directly affect me? No i do not. Suppliers supply, window cleaners clean. I want someone with experience. While Chris L is a supplier as well, like tony said, he has the credentials to represent us. He and his brother Alex have and do run a successful window cleaning business. They have “been there done that”. Theresa has also ran a successful window cleaning business. These are the “New Blood” i would like to see. Someone who runs a FULL TIME WINDOW CLEANING business not a part timer on the side. Craig Aldrich is the perfect example of New Blood in the IWCA. He is extremely knowledgeable, hardworking and he, most importantly, has “been there done that”. So no disrespect but i think that suppliers should supply window cleaners with what we need and let the actual window cleaners determine our industry standards and stances. The IWCA could be a great association if it could be unified, crisp and clear on stances and have strong leadership. Until that happens and the petty bickering and BS stop, it will continue to alienate many window cleaners who just dont want the drama.

10

When the bylaws were written I doubt the writers considered a time when one supply company can vote, and in the same board meeting sit with, other suppliers who can not vote.

We also have/had board members who profit from anchor installation related products/activities who can vote.

We also have/had water fed suppliers / manufacturers who can vote.

We also have/had companies who own/rent/sell lifts who can vote.

The purposes and intent, behind not giving associate members the right to vote, no longer apply.

Many associations allow all their members to vote and I think it is now time for the IWCA.

I pay my dues and watch while other companies and individuals who engage in similar activities are able to vote. “Taxation without representation”

CW

11

You fail to mention that those other board members have window cleaning companies and have voting rights thru those companies. There is no need for the IWCA to change the bylaws for the benefit of a few or just one.

12

Here’s what Paul West and Gary said about this very subject last year -
I remember this question coming up in the past. Gary answered the question in this email:

On Dec 1, 2008, at 3:13 PM, “Gary Mauer” <moms@wcmail.net> wrote:

>>>If a professional member becomes a non-voting Associate member then how can they serve as a regular board of director member?**-- Chris Wallace<<<
*
By maintaining theProfessional membership theirwindow cleaning business - as long as that is still viable.
*
It’s my understanding that an IWCA*Professional member can - and always has been able to -*purchase an additional Associate membership if they get involved in a service or product that is sold to Professional members.
*
Also my understanding that many who are eligible to be Associate members choose not to do so - and forego the benefits enjoyed by Associate members (such as they are.) Someone who chose not to become an Associate member would be ineligible to be appointed to the the BOD as an Advisory member.
*
Thanks,

Gary Mauer
Since 1996* - the Window Cleaning Network
Oconomowoc, Wisconsin, USA

Later Paul West, then president of the IWCA, confirmed that Gary was correct. In fact, he even stated “A person can run two separate companies and wear a different hat depending on the occasion.”

Thanks,
Micah Kommers
We Wash Windows
Greenville, SC __________________

13

I’d like to nominate Chris Wallace for Most Annoying Person/Dinosaur – Lifetime Achievement Award.

14

I second that

15

I’ll second that nomination (Linda beat me too it again). All in favor?:smiley:

16

I agree that the IWCA needs work. However what is the reason you want a vote? It doesnt affect your business does it? You will still sell the same amount of merchandise. Why would you want a say in what doesnt affect you? Is it politics? I think everyone running should show us credentials and state where they stand on fabrication debris and other important items that affect us as window cleaners.

17

I am trying to understand what this power struggle is about. I have no ax to grind.

If men who run businesses selling window cleaning products or running email lists are elevated to high places in the IWCA, might it not help their business and hurt their competitors? Why not?

Wouldn’t it elevate their status in the eyes of other window cleaners, and might that make a difference?

Is this really about friends helping friends and making money? If not, what is it really about? I mean really.

18

It boils down to this Chris Wallace wants to be given respect because he says he deserves it while taking shots at anybody who doesn’t give him said respect. Gar has similar issues. The problem occurs when anyone dares to enter their perceived area of control or get in their way.

19

Where did Chris Wallace take shots at someone? I haven’t been following this very much and am just now looking at it.

Gary wants control over his list. That is obvious. Why does he want control over his list? It is a money making thing for him, is it not? It appears to me that anything that might hurt his list business, as he sees it, is to be excluded from his list. It does not matter whether it is truth spoken, views that he does not think will further his goals, things that are not on his subject, or whatever it is. If he does not think it serves his purpose, he does not want it there. He would not want me there, for example, because what I am writing might be a hindrance instead of a help.

Freedom of expression is not a priority. Making money and holding a high position is. Am I missing something?

20

My answers in bold.