What do you guys think about certifications? Like say a safety certified window cleaner. The IWCA does something like that but I believe its mainly geared towards highrise. Do you see something like that working in residential / commercial. Would it be a good selling point to potential customers?
I am IWCCI Certified (RDS) with the IWCA. I do think this is an excellent idea, though certification can’t be too easy. Certification from a window cleaning safety standpoint is a great idea; more specific than OSHA 10 or 30. I’ve had several customers (not High Rise), REQUIRE IWCCI safety certification before bidding. I recieved a break on my insurance as well. The testing should be difficult, and not too cheap. I joined the MWCOA, but $50 doesn’t make me a “Master WCer”. If it costs you, you’ll make your employees live by it, and it’ll mark you as a committed professional. If it doesn’t, you’ll forget about it, and so will your customers. IWCCI Certification is availible in different levels from route & residential , through High Rise Specialist.
I think it has a real place for high rise work, but not for regular commercial route work or residential. This has been tried in the pressure washing/roof cleaning industry and it’s sort of a joke. It’s a good idea for those who are just getting started and need the experience - or a cheap way of finding out that the work is not for them. Could keep them from making a big investment in something they may not want to do later on. But for using certifications to market yourself (outside of high rise work) is a bit silly in my opinion.
Because it’s not necessary or it wasn’t done well?
Both.
Nothing will take the place of experience and caring. I don’t need a certification to prove those two benefits of my company. But then, I guess some companies do.
Kinda funny, there’s companies here that are claiming to be the only “certified” contractor in the area. Well, who certified them? A $100 bill did!
Ain’t that the truth…the biggest problem is who certifies the certified? It has to be something or a credible org in my opinion and there just isn’t any in the pressure washing/roof cleaning field. Too many power hungry people who either get in power or people trying their best to destroy the orgs.
The only people putting any significance on these penny ante “certifications” are the people trying to make money off of providing them.
They’re worse than a joke because they’re selling pie in the sky to gullible contractors who are trying to provide for their families.
I am for it especially in regards to helping train employees not necessarily an owner operator, but definately your crew. You can never train someone enough especially from a saftey standpoint. Even if it doesn’t help for advertising (which I think it would) It could make a cleaner have more of a sense of self worth and in return provide better overall results when they are in the feild.
I hate the idea. I became a window cleaner so I wouldn’t have to answer to anyone else when it came to the way I do things. Not to mention I agree with the other post that It seams more like a way for someone to make money off of the industry, and hurt a lot of guys in this industry who got into it because it was the one industry that allowed them to be their own boss without having to be rich. It allowed them to improve their live without having to rely on the whims of another guy to promote him.
That’s the one thing about this industry that I appreciate. Its an industry where someone who is down on there luck can come in and with not much to start with and a lot of hard work can actually make something of himself. It seems like a lot of guys are forgetting that and trying to make it into a high tech field in order to control more of the market in their area. Because they have a larger company and can generate more revenue they want to institute changes in the industry that give them a boost without considering how it might affect the smaller guys.
Don’t get me wrong I’m all for advancement. But lets not forget Where we came from. We are still just cleaning windows. When I first started cleaning windows I quit my job because I could not stand my boss anymore. I was only making 6-7 bucks an hour! I could not get a good paying job unless I lied about my juvenile record, which was in my past. I had been a changed man for years but no one would give me a decent chance. I did not even own a vehicle but I decided If I was going to get somewhere I was going to have to go at it on my own. That’s right I was a bucket Bob! Now I make over $100,000.00 a year, own a house and support a family. I could have never done that without the window cleaning industry being what it is. Outside of Christ I owe my life to the industry! I thank God for window cleaning!
I am not a bucket Bob anymore, because the industry allowed me to advance myself. Lets not forget why we started in the window cleaning business. Its was low cost, not a lot to learn, easy to advance and you can make good money. So lets not ruin it for everyone just to make a few bucks for ourselves!
While your at it quit hating on Bucket Bob. Maybe he is fighting for his survival and is desperate to change his life but can’t find anyone to help! Whenever I see a bucket Bob I don’t drive by and sling my coke out the window on him. I stop and encourage him. After all maybe someday he will become the next Son of Ettore!
That having been said, I think it might give start up guys some good safety training. Not to mention consumers do tend to see it as an added bonus. But lets be careful to keep the industry what it has been for years. Make it affordable for even start up guys. That is if your goal is really to improve the industry and not just to make a few more precious dollars for yourself! Sorry for the length.
I worked for a big building construction outfit named turner. They didn’t care for the paid certification we had. They wanted documented, twice a month, singed by employees and o.m.'s safety & fall & arrest training for thee entire length of the project. The project was children’s hospital of Philadelphia. I led the job, wich was very convenient. Because I lived across the street @ the main hospital where my daughter was shaking off nuroblastoma cancer.
The job went smooth and lasted for a month and a half and my kid won the fight for her life 2 weeks after the project was done. Sooo, document your own training for 15 minutes twice a month.
Great, send me $100 per guy and their name for the certificate and I will certify them. If it makes you feel better I’ll make them take an open book test. Don’t worry, everyone passes. I just want the money.
These “certifications” are generally just a piece of paper that you use in your sales pitch. If you want to find out if it’s worth anything ask your insurance agent how much being "certified"will save you on your premium. Ask the property manager on your next big bid if he has ever heard of the certifying body and cares about your piece of paper. You might be able to convince a homeowner that it makes you more qualified that a competitor, unless you’re selling against me and I kindly show then what kind of b.s. you’re trying to pull on them.
IWCCI certification is $600 per man, with our proctored test in Atlanta. Recertification every 5 yrs, based on changes in the I14. Two years ago, we won a $22000 per year, three year contract, because the other two bidders were disqualified for lacking this. For most work, its irelevant, I agree. But for us, its paid for itself over and over.
I am not a bucket Bob anymore, because the industry allowed me to advance myself. Lets not forget why we started in the window cleaning business. Its was low cost, not a lot to learn, easy to advance and you can make good money. So lets not ruin it for everyone just to make a few bucks for ourselves!
While your at it quit hating on Bucket Bob. Maybe he is fighting for his survival and is desperate to change his life but can’t find anyone to help! Whenever I see a bucket Bob I don’t drive by and sling my coke out the window on him. I stop and encourage him. After all maybe someday he will become the next Son of Ettore!
Couldn’t agree more. We all had to start somewhere, but it’s easy to forget once we are at the top of the mountain that we started at the bottom.
Was this a high rise account? I would have to say that a standard safety certification program for high rise would benefit the industry tremendously. No start up guy has any business doing high rise without formal training. A lot of people are put at risk when guys drop fro the side of a building. It would also help companies in the hiring process to determine an applicants qualifications and possibly skill level.
1-2 story commercial and residential are a different ball of wax. If a program existed it would have to be low cost as not to ruin the industry. I completed the IWCA safety training program a couple of years ago because I was wanting to go into high rise. It was a great program for high rise. They also did a segment on residential and ladder safety. It was very poor and you could tell the guy doing it was struggling to come up with enough material to even call it a program.
Maybe instead of getting certified in window cleaning or pwing, get certified in “green eco-friendly products” or something similar?
Shhhhhhh , don’t tell these guys why they are not awarded contracts.
Why have a certification , that make sense. Don’t be able to compete. That makes sense.
Sure to some here certs may seem useless.
Fact is we need to evolve into the future. Wcra needs to lead the way.
We can say its a paper or we can all write rfp’s that will separate wcra members from the rest.
It’s real and it’s the future, wash water control is coming to a neighborhood near you.
Clients that are responsible might choose someone who displays a safety record over a company that doesn’t. We are proud of ours and the reasons we can say no work related injury liabilities.
If you think these things can’t make a difference your foolish.
Ron Musgraves text me 480-5225227 ???Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I think its currently too much of a mess for residential certs to be taken seriously, but I see it being useful someday.
It probably won’t happen when most states don’t even require any kind of contractors license for janitorial services under $500.
When licensing for what we do is taken more seriously, so will certification.
Maybe more the reason guys here should promote it. Together if we start using the new wcra certified contractors logo that itself could make a difference.
Maybe only in spirit
Ron Musgraves text me for questions 480-522-5227 Pressure Washing Institute
I’m not talking about real, rigorously tested, established certs. I’m talking about “I showed up for an hour
’class’ and paid my money so give me my made-up certification and sticker” certs.
The day WCRA starts selling/ promoting bull**** “certifications” it no longer is about real value for contractors and I am out.
I didn’t think wcra would ever do such a thing.
So what would be a real criteria?
Content , test , obviously the important things.
Would a numbers of years be a factor?
The instructor teaching ??
Good thoughts on what makes this legit?
Ron Musgraves text me for questions 480-522-5227 Pressure Washing Institute
